Israel Folau, what did he really post?

Trying to find the original post that has started all of this fuss with Israel Folau has been difficult. I wanted to see FOR MYSELF what he actually posted that has now been deemed to be a “High level breach” by Rugby Australia.

Well, here it is:


“

Those that are living in Sin will end up in Hell unless you repent. Jesus Christ loves you and is giving you time to turn away from your sin and come to him.
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Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these , adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, envyings, murders, drunkenness, revelings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.
Galatians 5:19-21 KJV

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Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
Acts 2:38 KJV

_______________

And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:
Acts 17:30 KJV
_______________”



Note that I am no Techno-head, so putting the actual post itself into this was beyond my skill level.

What I have done is find the image that he posted and pasted it into this, and then I have copied the text that he wrote, and the verse quotes that he included. To the best of my knowledge this is exactly what he posted, correct image and word for word.



I think it would be worthwhile examining exactly what Mr Folau DID say, rather than everyone getting up in arms about what he didn’t actually say.

So, I am sorry Mr Folau, but I am going to examine your post, and more particularly your words in greater detail than anyone really deserves, but I think it is necessary to find out the truth.

• ·       First of all the image posted.

Keep in mind that I don’t think Mr Folau made this image. I assume (and I am sorry but it is an assumption) that Mr Folau saw this image on line and reposted it, but he obviously agreed with the basics of it.

The Image states that for a variety of people listed – 8 different groups are listed overall – that Hell awaits them. The image then calls for those people included in the list to repent, and notes that only Jesus saves.

A few things to note about this image itself.

It does not single out any particular group listed over any other group.

The image is not specifically attacking homosexuals, as is the focus of the claims against My Folau. In fact, if one were to take a step back you would find that not many people are left out of that list. I don’t think I have ever met a person who has not lied at some time, and most of us have stolen something somewhere along the way – not a car, but maybe a pen or something like that.

Where is there any indication in the image itself that Mr Folau is attacking any particular group? There is no such indication. In fact the image has a list that actually includes every person ever – including Mr Folau himself (Which I am sure he would openly acknowledge).

Now then, is the image attacking anyone?

No, it is not. There is no attack. There is a statement of what Mr Folau and many others believe is a fact: that any sinner is bound for Hell.

This is not an attack. It is a statement. If I was to state “You are going to die”, it doesn’t mean that I want it to be so, or that I intend to cause it to be so. It doesn’t necessitate any feeling toward you of any sort – either hatred or love. It is information that I believe to be true.

And it is in fact true – every person will die one day. You might be offended at my pointing that out, but it will not stop you from dying. And it makes no difference whether I like you, hate you, or am ambivalent to you, the fact is that one day you will die. There is no attack, just a statement of information.

If however, I knew you were going to die of some particular disease, and I recognised it, and knew the cure, then told you about that cure, that is not attacking, nor is it hateful. In fact it is loving.

This image does nothing more than that.

The originator of the image believes that all the people listed are destined for Hell, but he (or she) does not want the people listed to end up in Hell, and so they state the cure, salvation through Jesus.

There is nothing hateful nor accusatory in the image.

• ·         What about the statement that Mr Folau makes after the image?

“Those that are living in Sin will end up in Hell unless you repent. Jesus Christ loves you and is giving you time to turn away from your sin and come to him.”

So, Mr Folau doesn’t single out any particular group in this statement either. He says “Those that are living in sin”. There is only one conclusion to take from the reaction to this part of the statement – those who are offended know that they are living in sin. If they didn’t know that, they would have simply considered that Mr Folau was referring to others. Their outrage actually shows that they consider themselves among “those that are living in sin”. Mr Folau didn’t designate them as such. He simply gave a warning that “those who are living in sin will end up in hell unless you repent. Again, Mr Folau is not attacking anyone. He is simply stating what he believes is the destiny of those “who are living in sin”.

And again, his purpose is to show that they have a way to avoid Hell.

It is not an accusation, but a warning. He is not accusing people of living in sin, but pointing out that those WHO ARE living in sin have a destiny that ends in Hell. Those who are fussing about this are the ones who are designating themselves as “living in sin”.

The simple conclusion to come to about this statement is that if you are not living in sin then Mr Folau doesn’t believe that you will end up in Hell. (Note that the Bible has a lot to say about this beyond this simplistic conclusion)

Far from accusing, Mr Folau points out what he believes of “Those that are living in sin”. He doesn’t designate any groups at all in his own words.

He also points out the solution for “Those that are living in sin”.

His statement only and clearly applies to “those who are living in sin”.

Apparently, the drunkards, the adulterers, the liars etc don’t consider themselves to be living in sin, because they haven’t kicked up a fuss. It is only the Homosexuals that have designated themselves to be included in the statement “those that are living in sin”, not Mr  Folau.

And even so, all Mr Folau has done is show that there is a solution to the sin and Hell problem that he points out: Salvation through Jesus Christ.

·         After this, Mr Folau quoted three Bible passages. Mr Folau cannot be held responsible for the words of the Bible, for he didn’t write it. He did of course choose which passages to quote, but as far as I can tell, it is still legal to quote the Bible in Australia. (It apparently is not allowed if you are employed by the ARU. That would seem to be discriminatory against religious persons, but the ARU is supposed to be non-discriminatory…)

o   Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these , adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, envyings, murders, drunkenness, revelings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.
Galatians 5:19-21 KJV

In examining this passage, we note a few things: this passage does not even mention homosexuality specifically. It would of course be encompassed under adultery, fornication, and possibly uncleanness, but it is not specifically noted. In fact what we have here is a wide ranging list of people who the Bible says will not inherit the kingdom of God. But Homosexuals are not even specified here.

______________

o  
Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
Acts 2:38 KJV

Again, there is no mention of any specific group in this list apart from “every one of you”. It speaks only of remission of sins through Jesus Christ. This verse doesn’t even talk about the consequences if someone doesn’t repent of their sins and trust Jesus Christ.

_______________

o  
And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:
Acts 17:30 KJV

And again, there is no mention of any consequences for anyone, just that God calls all men everywhere to repent.

So then, having looked at the post that has caused all the fuss and trouble, I am astounded at the way that this has been handled by the LBGT etc and also by the Media.

To the LBGT etc (I am sorry but I can’t keep up with the current letters included in this group as it seems to change every couple of weeks), I have to ask why you are so offended at this post? Where did Mr Folau specify your group in particular?

In his own words he doesn’t even mention “Homosexuals” or any other designation of your group. The name is one of 8 in the original image list, and it is not even the first on the list.

Nowhere else in the entire post of Mr Folau is the LBGT etc group even referred to.


Secondly, Mr Folau nowhere states that he is sending them to Hell, nor does he state that he wants them to go to Hell, nor does he state that he is rejoicing at the thought of them going to Hell. In fact, it is implicit in his statements that Mr Folau doesn’t want them to go to Hell, because he includes statements and Bible references that show how they can avoid that destiny.


There are only two possible conclusions that can be drawn from the resultant media coverage: The LBGT etc have launched a totally unjustified attack, misrepresenting what Mr Folau posted for the purpose of destroying this man and attacking the current religious freedoms in Australia, and secondly, the Australian Media are either allowing themselves to be deceived by the LBGT etc or are inherently involved the attack against Mr Folau and against Australian religious freedom. If they were not involved (deliberately or naively) they would show the post in its entirety and show clearly that the Homosexual groups are not in fact targeted.


As to Rugby Australia and their panel that have now found Mr Folau guilty of a High level breach, we must ask “Where in the post that Mr Folau made is there any breach of any code of conduct? How is it in any way hateful to warn someone of what you believe to be impending danger? Indeed, Mr Folau has not even designated any particular group as sinners, but included all men – ALL MEN as sinners.



The only conclusion we can come to with regard to Rugby Australia is that they are allowing themselves to be influenced by their major sponsor, who apparently doesn’t think Australia should have free speech. At least not free speech that disagrees with the thoughts of their current boss.

I for one am disgusted at the treatment of Mr Folau by the Australian press, by Rugby Australia, and by many commentators who apparently feel that looking at the actual statements of Mr Folau are not necessary. The ARU have sold Mr Folau out for sponsorship money.


I am not in the least surprised by the LGBT etc groups who are attacking Mr Folau without mercy, not for what he has said, but for the fact that he is a Christian who is willing to quote the Bible.

Mr Folau has said nothing offensive to homosexuals in particular – in fact, nothing AT ALL to homosexuals in particular. Mr Folau addressed “Those who are living in sin” without further definition. Who is it that has designated homosexuals as sinners? Not Mr Folau. It is actually those who are accusing him who have designated themselves as sinners.



The actual roots of this whole affair are based in those who wish to silence the Bible and remove any reference to God and the Word of God from our society.

Alan Jones has said that the Australian people won’t stand for it. I hope he is right, but I fear he is wrong.

My fear is that not enough regular Australians care enough to stand with Mr Folau in his battle for the right to express his own opinion.

Today it is the right of one man to express an opinion that is being restricted. Tomorrow it may be the right of others to express their opinion that is taken away. When and where will it stop?


They call men like Mr Folau intolerant, but he is not the one who stopping others from having an opinion.

I will fight for the right of every man to be free to express his opinion, whether I agree with him or not. The way our nation is going, I am falling into a minority.

My opinion will soon be illegal if things continue the way they appear to be going.

Only opinions that “fit with the acceptable” will be allowed to be expressed. Who then decides what is acceptable? And what stops your opinion – whatever that may be – from becoming unacceptable?


No one should be able to call others to physical violence. No one should be able to promote attacks on other people. No one should be able to take away another person’s rights without just cause and due process.

But every man should be able to express an opinion.

I will fight for your right to oppose me and present an opposing opinion.

Because stopping talk doesn’t solve problems. Just because I can silence you, doesn’t mean the problem is solved. Just because you can silence me, doesn’t mean that your problems are now solved.

In context of Mr Folau’s post, you can stop it from being posted around, you can take away his career, you can silence him by deleting or covering his opinion wherever you can, but it will not change for one moment that fact that all men have sinned and come short of the glory of God, and that the Wages of sin is death, and that Hell is final destiny of everyone who has not trusted in Jesus Christ as their saviour.

Whether it is stated, read, proclaimed, or even tweeted OR NOT – it is still true.

Whether you believe it or not is up to you, but the question has to be asked: If you don't believe what Mr Folau has posted is true, why does it concern you? He hasn't named any particular person or even a particular group. He has not called for any group of people to be persecuted or banned. He has not in any way promoted violence against any particular group (or even general violence for that matter).
He has spoken of a destiny that he believes is as stated in the Bible. If you don't believe the Bible is true, why do you care what this man says about what you believe is fanciful?


It is not hateful to warn about that problem.

It is loving to warn someone of impending danger and then tell them of the way of avoiding that danger.


Mr Folau, I know it is easy for me to say this because it is not my wage, not my reputation, not my future that is on trial and at stake, but good on you for making your original post, and for standing your ground. On my examination (which counts for nothing) you have done nothing wrong, nothing hateful, nothing for which you need to apologise.
Rest in the Lord and trust in Him.

1Pe 4:
14 If ye be reproached for the name of Christ, happy are ye; for the spirit of glory and of God resteth upon you: on their part he is evil spoken of, but on your part he is glorified.

16 Yet if any man suffer as a Christian, let him not be ashamed; but let him glorify God on this behalf.